Warped Reed Pan

[Paul Read]

The chamois leather approach avoids the possibility of cracking the reed pan or breaking an end bolt that could occur with other suggested options (depending on the degree of warp). The chamois is very easy to work especially as it stretches easily and the required thickness variation can be achieved by varying the tension as you install it. Ideally, I would recommend replacing the existing chamois throughout the reed pan chambers and using different thicknesses as required. One hide/sheet of chamois will vary in thickness in different sections. It is easy to cut and easy to install.

 

I'm sure a number of the options so far suggested would work. This one probably carries less risk of damage. I won't be so arrogant as to say the other options are second class. It all depends on the actual situation. This is what you'll need to assess in deciding the way ahead.

 

Lots to choose from!

[JimLucas]

The chamois leather approach avoids the possibility of cracking the reed pan or breaking an end bolt that could occur with other suggested options....

Paul, you're implying dangers of damage that in my experience don't exist in real situations.

 

If others have tried my approach and experienced consequent damage, I would change my tune. Any first-hand reports, folks?

 

By the way, I did try building up the gasketing to compensate for warping on a couple of early repairs, but I subsequently found shimming the reed block supports to give superior results with far less effort.

[Clive Thorne]

Jim,

 

Are you missing Goran ?

 

Clive.

[malcolm clapp]

It's an Ebay concertina from Australia last tuned and repaired on 6/10/79.

 

I assume 1979, not 1879.

 

If I was the repairer, sorry, my 24 year extended warranty period has just expired.

 

Seriously though, I think any competent repairer should be able to remedy this problem, and I would hesitate to suggest you do it yourself. Without being rude, it sounds like you are not too experienced with such things, and I think you could do a lot of damage.

My best advice, without seeing the concertina, is to carefully put it tightly back together and leave it in a fairly humid environment for a week or so, then try playing it again and see what happens....I have done this many times with excellent results and no cost involved.

 

watching my 'chromatic tuner'. It took a full stroke to get a button

to sound and then it would indicate 1 note then a followon different note.

 

This does not indicate any problem with warping; it sounds like the tuner is picking up a harmonic or partial. Rely on your ears, not on needles or LEDs, to indicate whether or not two notes may or may not be sounding at once. If I play two notes simultaniously into my tuner, it swings around wildly and eventually settles on a note that is neither of the ones I played! The way electronic tuners function is a bit off topic here, but like all such aids they have their limitations.

Having said that, I would not attempt to fine tune without one, and I have nothing but admiration for those who do/did so with accuracy.

 

Regards

Malcolm Clapp

Australian Repairer

[duckln]

Thanks

 

When I check my Edeo it seems to land on 'zero' or within a few cents, but it must

have top shelf reeds in it. The 'old' Anglo's reeds look crude, some chipped at the

tips and probably have more harmonics.

 

My ears are not the best. When I watched the piano tuner, I can't hear the 'beats'

he hears. If I can get the Anglo working better, I'll have a professional tune it.

 

Incidentally, steaming the reed pan, for 8 minutes took the warp out of it. Almost

straight as whistle, just like VernL said.

 

regard

Joe

[Paul Groff]

Hope you took all the reeds out first!

[Paul Read]

Joe,

 

It's great that the steaming worked. This has the advantage of leaving things as close to original as possible. Did you clamp it for a while to keep it flat or did closing it into the instrument do that?

 

It will be interesting to get your report on how it fares down the road.

[d.elliott]

Joe,

 

earler someone mentioned 'little beam's, I have a baritone anglo undergoing restoration, this has 'little beams' fitted on the inner face of each reed pan. these are full width of the reed pan, but stopping before they foul the bellows. Each beam is hardwood, around 3/8ins thick and 3/4 ins deep. The beams are screwed through their stong axis onto the reed pan. I would expect that this could be used to stabalise or even pull straight the warped pan. Photo can be arranged

 

Dave

[duckln]

Paul Groff

Hope you took all the reeds out first!

 

me

No I didn't. They are brass reeds and and had droplets on

them that I just wiped off.

 

P Read

It's great that the steaming worked. This has the

advantage of leaving things as close to original

as possible. Did you clamp it for a while to keep it

flat or did closing it into the instrument do that?

It will be interesting to get your report on how it

fares down the road.

 

me

I clamped it overnight or 24 hrs.(pix) By the time I was ready

to put it into the concertina, it warped back, but how much,

I didn't measure. So I steamed it for 8-10 minutes until it

straightened out and immediately put it into the concertina.

I'll take it apart again, when I do the other side, and measure

and steam again to see if successive steaming reduces the

warp.

 

Dave

...The beams are screwed through their

strong axis onto the reed pan. I would expect that

this could be used to stabilize or even pull

straight the warped pan. Photo can be arranged

 

me

Great, post a picture if you can. I'd like to see if

washers are used, ect. If the steaming isn't a

permanent fix, I may go with the beams. But

I may not make them so big. Maybe start with

3/16" by 1/2.

Thanks for your crucial input. It makes sense to

me considering that my ends are very straight which

must be due to the handles (beam).

 

Joe

[d.elliott]

pictures of the little beams, they actually act like stiffening webs in structural steelwork

 

Dave

 

 

edited for spelling

 

and sign off!

Edited February 14, 2004 by d.elliott

[d.elliott]

another detail of the reed pan stiffening 'beam'

 

 

beam me up........

 

Dave

[JimLucas]

pictures of the little beams,...

Interesting and enlightening.

 

....I wonder about the use of the word "little", though.

[d.elliott]

all things are relative!

 

steelworks crane beams (I) section, four foot flanges and six foot webs, big beams?

 

These depicted are little wooden beams, on an anglo baritone.

 

D

[JimLucas]

all things are relative!

Indeed they are... and relative to most other parts in a concertina, those beams are "big".

[d.elliott]

follow the thread back to see orign of the expression.

 

I have not seen beams in a concertina before, but the depth of these could each have been increased by another 3/4 ins or so, even more. The limiting factors being: screw length, and the space between the reed pans with the bellows compressed. This is a most viable option for pulling a reed pan flatter.

 

Dave

[JimLucas]

I'm curious. Do the "beams" have any noticeable effect on the sound?

[malcolm clapp]

I have seen something very similar on a Dipper Cotswold D/G owned by a friend in Australia.

Perhaps Colin can enlighten us further....

Regards

Malcolm

[duckln]

follow the thread back to see orign of the expression.

 

I have not seen beams in a concertina before, but the depth of these could each have been increased by another 3/4 ins or so, even more. The limiting factors being: screw length, and the space between the reed pans with the bellows compressed. This is a most viable option for pulling a reed pan flatter.

 

Dave

Dave

 

Thanks for the pictures.

 

Seems to me that the screws should come in from the other side and possibly have

washers so that the heads don't pull through.

Also, in that it is a beam, it should be more rectangular than square. Maybe even tappered

on the ends were the stresses are less and there's bellows limitations.

 

Now I've got to do some beam experimentation. I'm thinking of no screws, and going across

the middle of the hole with a second 'teeny weeny' beam that just spans the hole on the chamber side.

And with a 'hoot and nanny', lock the reed pan between the two beams.

 

Another thing I'm pondering is why not remove some of the 'chamber' walls in the center area? There, their

function is dubious and being wedged into the reed pan, contribute to the warping problem.

 

Joe